You’ve pretty much described our own situation there as well Silk. Spurs fans have as much say in that decision as we have in any of the awful decisions made here.

TF - we will only be an attractive proposition when we clear the debt. No-one is going to take on a club with a £10 million debt unless he is already a Dons supporter. It has nothing to do with our stance. If we sell him the majority he doesn't have to give a fuck about the supporters feelings. Look at Spurs removing concessions for pensioners. The only way the supporters can fight that is by boycotting matches and not enough will do that

Trebor - I don't think the thresholds for member resolutions are affected by membership growing, it's 2/3rds of votes, not 2/3rds of members to pass, I think? More broadly, agree with you entirely - I have to admit, I had previously thought some of your concerns about direction of travel were alarmist. But you were right, and it's too late now.

(My typing when on my tablet is awful – my fingers can't cope with moving larger distances.and I think my autocorrect gives up.)

It seems a shift to a much more "top down" approach, which to be fair is probably the most important st efficient way of running a professional business in terms of decision making, but does kind of throw out of the window the "hopes and dreams" that a lot of people thought the club was founded on. But then the board can't go back and re-decide history: the discussion about "What sort of democracy do we want?" has been avoided ever since 2002 and has instead been resolved by a sequence of little-discussed decisions that have nudged it in one direction.

I still don't get how giving free membership to season ticket holders will make them more engaged. I guess it does make more sense if the board has decided there will be far fewer member votes and more "surveys" that people can quickly react to. That inevitably hands much more power to the board as they can "package" the surveys and then "interpret" the results however they see fit .And that's one way of running the club – representative democracy rather than participatory democracy, (albeit 'listening representation', I'm sure they'd say). But all introduced with very little talking through the implications, just like setting up the plc in 2003. And it effect me vely rules out any member initiated decision making because the threshold for submitting resolutions etc is now so high?

The club is being taken down a different path that’s for sure. And many loyal members of the DT are being tested. Their patience wearing thin. There is an endgame which in truth isn’t being that well disguised. The argument over whether being fan owned is the be all and end all of what we do as a club is close to another tipping point. Its how we all react to it that’s important

I think we’d find a buyer or buyers pretty quickly if we made ourselves an attractive proposition I.e. it’s a purchase not a fucking donation. But that would mean abandoning whatever illusion “fan owned” has mutated into. I used to be a fan owned stalwart but I’d most definitely consider the alternative these days as the club is being abused.

Silk - it may be a meaningless debate to you but that doesn't make you right in saying it is a meaningless debate for others. The governance of the Trust and club will in the long run determine whether we go into administration, lose our league place (maybe the same thing) or eventually find a way to be a well run, financially stable, fan owned club. If you don't care then that is up to you.

CW - the Sky/Premier League thing in 92 fundamentally changed the game. Whilst money had some bearing we and clubs like Luton and Coventry showed you could get by on heart. This was because the bigger clubs had less money and the gap was not big. The Prem League and now the Champions League money has now created a gap that cannot be bridged by heart alone. And the only way to compete is to spend what you don't have.

Keefy - it remains to be seen if the £1.8 million loss was a one-off or the norm. I think the previous year it was at least a million less and chunk on that was interest on the debt. It may mean we do not have to sell to survive if our losses is under a million in the next annual reports. We could have our finance committee report on a quarterly basis as a lot of companies do. It could allay the speculation a bit.

Silk-I think money always talked even back in the 60s when we were winning the Amateur cup by illegally paying our players.Clubs in the poorer parts of town like Romford and Hillingdon went bust whereas the more affluent areas like Barnet and Wimbledon they kept going

We won't stay as we are if we cannot sell a gem every year we will go onto admin

Things like the ST/DT debate are a meaningless distraction. Unless it gives us a new source of income then whatever side prevails it won't make a bit of difference to where we are as a club.

We are in a Catch-22 situation. The reason we are running at a loss is because we pay our players more than can afford. If we paid our players what we can afford then we would do what Sutton are doing and go down, as they have been more realistic about the wages they pay, by all accounts. There is nothing that either WISA or the DT can do unless they have a big pile of cash to invest in the club. And we do not have anyone who wants to buy us and invest a shitload of cash in us. So we are stuck at standing still until we at least pay the stadium debt off. The EFL clubs a whole should collectively agree to pay lower wages but that will never happen. The politics of this club is now very boring as only more money will make any change.

Thought those running the Dons Trust and Wisa were part of the same clique?

Ferret that seems an appropriate solution to fight the right-on nonsense that's been happening over the last five years. I generally agree with what the supporters trust SHOULD stand for, but it seems to me that here at least, there's a gap in reality between those who are running it and those who should be served by them. From Buckingham babies to video gate to the ST/DT debacle we are seeing today, they appear to be heading the same way as Supporters Direct. They shot themselves in the foot when their politicians from within overstepped who they are, pretty much inline with how things are happening now.

If you don’t want to opt in or out of the Dons Trust you could of course join WISA it’s only a fiver

I can't be bothered to relitigate the whole ST/DT thing again, but merely would point out we are planning to charge some members double and some nothing. Deeply confused stuff. Also means the club will be paying some members' subs for them ie the owned body will be paying for its own ownership. It's governance gibberish.

RIP Leighton James.

I'm on the cricket green. They're still putting the fire out. The old girl looks in a sorry state.

Evening Scotty, have a little read back. ?

Timmy - the disused Cumberland hospital in Mitcham "mysteriously" burnt down as well back in the late 80s when there was a lot of dispute about what to do with it.

Late 80s we use to meet in there on a Friday,as we had a couple of mitcham womble mates.

Guess it will be easier to turn into flats now