Anyone know if we pay to be a part of the The FSA?

I think realistically the option to sell entirely is the only one that might attract any significant external investment.

So it looks like the only way to raise more money will be to charge the wealthier a load more for the product (which of course many of us will do), and accept that attendances will fall to around 6k - plus sell our best players over and over, thereby resigning ourselves to a forever future in L2 (with the occasional season or two in L1 if we get lucky). Have I got that about right?

Milking the fans for more money is not the way forwards. The fans have done everything in the past 20+ years to get us to this point, we now need help to get us further

Looking at actions 7, 8, 11 & 13 in [Link] it would appear that the SRAs could be discarded/revised with a current class A vote (as voted on for 50.01)

The whole idea of the trust was to run a sustainable, prudent football club. Unfortunately without realising we drifted away from that bit by bit from around 2003 onwards.

Yet again, a sloppy email from the DTB with the same link twice and no link to the 'BLUE-PAPER'

I believe we are Nicander

Stuart your second comment is exactly what I've just said before I saw it. Totally agree, tell people what being an owner really means.

Stuart if you're a trust member then you're an owner. Bailing out losses is what 90% of English professional football club owners do. Including when decision makers make bad decisions. So it sort of is your place, my place and everyone else's place who is an owner, as an owner, to do that. The idea that we can't keep asking people to do this is the exact thing that will stop people realising what being an owner actually means. The sooner that harsh reality is actually put to people the sooner we get a real view of what most of the owners actually want.

Stu - I think we're agreeing.

Stu - I think what I'm saying is at the moment many of us who would have the ability to pay more don't want to because we see money being left on the table (lack of fundraising, commercials not great and no real explanation why, club paying for memberships etc etc) and are not confident there is a realistic plan to stem losses. But if there was a narrative we all bought into, that treated us like the owners of the club instead of mugs, and there was a realistic way through - then our options are pay what we need to or sell up or get relegated. Same choices all club owners have.

I give up FFS

If you want things to chance, then a chance of approach is very much needed*

The club need to come up with a plan and if increasing the contribution from every fan is the answer, put that on a document of what the predicted costs are and let the members see the real truth of being fan-owned.

I refuse to pay anymore than I do. Yes I am a member of the club but it doesn’t mean it all falls on us to pay extra to cover the losses. When does it stop? Do we increase tickets every year to cover the loses or compete.

All theoretical of course, but in bunging cash in, are you going to continues to bail out the floods with the same sieve, or are you going to choose a new sieve in hopes that its better than the previous one? Nothing suggest the current crop have the imagination or ability to change things on the slide, the new lot maybe have the same outcome, or worse lets not forget. But one thing is pretty clear if history is anything to go by, vote the same and we'll definitely be here, having the same conversations next year. If you want things to chance, then a chance of approach is very much needed.

nicander that's spot on, what I would/wouldn't or could/couldn't hand over every year is definitely going to be influenced by what I think of the DTB members that get a controlling say on things. The interesting thing is I'd be surprised if anyone who could buy the extra shares doesn't have the same view as the rest of us about wanting to be an owner for that money, not subservient to what can come across as a clique.

Or alternatively, we need to be in the top few % of financially well run clubs - which is hard but probably more realistic than Championship in five years.

Lurks @ 10:33 - Spot on. Being a football owner in this country is effectively subsidising other peoples fun for some sense of prestige or other ancillary benefits. You can be a 'Fair Game' revolutionary all you want but those facts aren't going to change in a hurry. So if we want to be fans owned, we have to recognise that it will fall to the fans to plug the finance gaps.

Lurker - I don't disagree. But it all comes back around to the same argument - I would absolutely pay an extra £300 a year (or more) if the alternative was no club, but I then would be even less inclined to be mugged off repeatedly by the powers that be, so we're back at change of approach. And back to "owners", not "members", which is v much against the club's current direction of travel.

Lurker - that's very true - I suspect that the number of fans willing to fund £500PA in addition to the cost of season tickets etc is going to be pretty small - certainly not enough to cover the losses.

Stu D, Why indeed, the response by Mark Davis on PB earlier, is spot on. He started the thread titled Super RA in the ATB section. It refers to not continuing with this vote and letting a new DTB deal with it under their terms and not hamstring them with a decision they've not had a say on, yet will need to clean up.

Hash/Lurks - Part of the 50.01 argument is that some of the equity might be used for other things like which could in turn lead to increased revenue, such as fitting out the third floor or improving the training facilities. Ultimately it's about flexibility not silver bullet solutions and with or without 50.01 we always needed to dramatically improve our financial performance if we want to remain fans owned.

nicander what I've come to realise over the last 6-12 months is that if/when we struggle to repay the bulk of the bonds, that's when the die hard fan owned people will realise what owning a professional English football club actually means. Putting your hands into your own pockets every single year. Not to buy a ticket or a shirt. That's what supporters do. But to put in your own money to keep the club running. Right now it would take an extra £300 pa from each DT member, i.e. owner, to keep the current budget sustainable. To improve it we're talking at least £500 pa each. That's the realistic cost of owning a professional football club. And since all ST holders are DT owners, increasing prices will effectively do the same to those people. The majority of the increase will be picked up there.